[This is adapted from "Talking Money," coming soon from The Freelancery.]
Here’s a pricing technique that sounds, at first, like the dumbest newbie move of all time.
Call it ‘fill-in-the-blank’ invoicing. Or ‘pay what you want’ pricing.
The notion is, you do the work first, then let the client decide how much to pay for it.
I know, that sounds like a sure way to end up working for nickels and peanuts. I once thought that way, too.
But it’s actually an ingenious tactic that should be in every freelancer’s arsenal, ready to wheel out when the wind is right. (Notice I said when the wind is right. We’ll come back to that.)
It goes like this.
Instead of quoting a fee or negotiating a price in advance, you tell the client:
“Here’s what I suggest. Let me jump in and do the work as we discussed. I’ll hit this as hard as I know how, and make it as good as can be done.”
“When we’re finished, just pay whatever you feel the work was worth, based on what it contributed to your overall project.”
“I’ll accept whatever you decide, no questions asked. Provided it is more than a buck sixty-five.”
Scary? Absolutely.
Risky? Maybe a little.
Foolhardy and stupid? Not at all.
I had dabbled with this tactic before, but only on those small, oddball projects a client would send me now and then.
“I have no idea what to bill for this,” I’d say. “Just send me whatever seems right to you.” Sometimes they would send a hundred or two more than I anticipated, sometimes less. But it was always intriguing to see how the client perceived what I had done. And a little humbling, too, on occasion.
But over the past year or so I finally got the guts to try this on large projects for big clients. (Partly because, while developing “Talking Money,” I was thinking/obsessing about pricing issues pretty much all day long. I was itching to see how this worked.)
I can tell you this: the ‘pay what you want’ idea can be suprisingly and dumbfoundingly profitable.
Better still, I can guarantee you that it will shake up your thinking about fees and pricing. It will un-stick some old notions. And heaven knows we need that; most of us are way too myopic, constipated and chickenshit about fees.
As an added bonus, you will most likely do the best work of your life, and deliver obscenely wonderful service to your clients at the same time. (Mainly because you’ll be too scared not to.)
Making it pay. More.
Naturally, the sole reason for using fill-in-the-blank invoicing is to net more from a project than you could with “traditional” pricing.
The idea is to get paid for the value the client derives from the work, rather than for the number of hours it took. Or how hard it was. Or how many shots you had to take. Or what somebody else charged some other client somewhere.
And by value, I don’t mean only hard economic value, like sales or savings or new business. (Which in most cases is hard to quantify anyway.)
As I’ve discovered, clients are also willing to pay lavishly to get a nosebleed project done and off the desk, to look like geniuses in front of their bosses, to have presentations that their sales people rave about. To finally get the bosses sold on videos for user training. To untangle a project that somebody else screwed up.
That kind of value has no relation to how long it took you to do the job. It’s irrelevant, immaterial. And it is difficult to guess what that value might be from our side of the glass. So it can pay to let the client set that value.
Example.
A client of mine was knee-deep in redoing all her company’s web site content. She was getting raw material from the various divisions that was ugly, undeciperhable and unusable. The go-live date was looming. She called me in to figure out how to fix it all.
But she had no idea how many sections we’d be doing, how many pages, nor how bad the raw material would be, so it was impossble to estimate any sort of fee.
I said, “Let me just concentrate on getting this done for you, and we’ll settle up later. I trust you to be fair.” She agreed.
I did the work as it came in over a couple of weeks, revising, re-writing, re-building the content. We came up with a neat and tight format, a solid voice, sharp messaging. Everybody loved it.
I then told the client to let me know what she felt was a reasonable fee for the project. It was entirely her call.
Meanwhile, I went back and parsed out the work based purely on hours spent. Had I been pricing conventionally, it would have come to 3800 to 4200 bucks, depending on how I counted.
Next day, I get an email from the client. She says “I’m thinking $9,500. How does that sound?”
I wrote her back and said “Fine. Sold.”
Now, lest you think I’m just handing you rosy stories, here’s another.
A designer friend is working on a web site for a financial firm, two partners. He refers them to me for the writing. We have a few phone conversations. Seems simple enough. Not a ton of content, straightforward mission. The clients don’t know much about marketing or web stuff.
I say, “Tell you what. I’ll write everything for you, and when you’re happy with it, send me a check for what you think is reasonable.”
Ordinarily, I would have quoted about $2500 for the project, although I don’t say that.
I do some drafts. There are some comments, some revisions. Slam dunk. Site goes live. Time to settle up. And I’m thinking the Wall Street guys are seeing a fee with a lot of zeros.
They send a check for $1200. And say, ‘Thanks for the great work.”
Ouch and a half.
What works, what doesn’t
After a few painful scorchings, and several delightfully lucrative wins, here is the bottom line.
This technique works only when:
- You have a long-term relationship with the client. You’ve done work for them before, at your usual rates. They trust you. They know your work. And mostly likely they need to work with you again.
Don’t try this with one-time clients, clients who don’t use this work often, or clients who didn’t seek you out. Been there, done that, lost shirt.
- The client has a big personal stake in the project. They have skin in the game. They stand to look grand if all goes well, score some points, be a hero, win some kudos. This does not work for low-level back-burner projects that no one cares about. (Like my Wall Street clients; to them, their website was just some bullshit thing they needed to have. They didn’t perceive it as critical.)
- The project looks hard, impossible, indecipherable. (My Wall Street clients thought it was a cinch to bang out a few pages of drivel, and therefore paid accordingly. My technology client tried untangling her web content herself, and got scared. To her, it seemed unsurmountable.)
How do clients react? Do clients like this idea?
A few will balk. They don’t want the responsibility of figuring out a fee. They don’t want the anguish. That’s okay. Give them a quote.
Most will be astonished that you offer the option. It shows you trust them. That you value their judgment. That you even thought to ask. Huge karma points translate to more dollars.
Sometimes (as one client confessed to me) they’ll reflexively crank up the fee when filling in the blank.
Sort of like the way we reflexively and fearfully crank down the price when the client says ‘How much will it cost?”
—
Just so you know I’m not the only crackpot using this idea, Matt Homann of LexThink, a consultant who works with law firms, offers this ‘you decide’ option to all of his clients. His experience with the technique mirrors mine exactly. There’s more about his approach here too, in The Non-Billable Hour. (It’s for lawyers, but the ideas apply to us, I think.)
Oh, and see the classic Little Rascals episode from 1936, “Pay as You Exit.” As the story goes, the gang was putting on a show in the barn, but the neighborhood kids were reluctant to pay the penny admission, fearing that the show might be lame.
Over Spanky’s objections, Alfalfa decided to let everyone in for free, and allow them to pay on the way out if they liked the show.
As it turned out, the gang botched the show horribly, but the result was so hilarious that the kids filed out laughing.
Leaving Alfalfa with cigar box full of pennies.
Interesting post. Seems like an insane idea – don’t think I’d ever try it myself. In my opinion, being easy-going and fun to work with is one thing. People approach you for professional work and a professional demeanor. I think being solid in project expectations and costs throughout the entire work process helps solidify that. If you’re wishy-washy about what your work/time is worth, your integrity could come into question. This almost seems like an eerie ripple of the crowdsourcing “name-your-own-price” pond.
The situation where you pulled off a great job and were compensated double what you expected is way cool – there’s certainly opportunity for situations like this. Personally, I’m not sure if I’d want to take chances like that, especially in this economy. Seems like a risky game of roulette!
Thanks for the post.
That’s an interesting technique. The points under “What works and what doesn’t” are critical to know prior to trying this technique. Can’t say that I’ll be trying this but it’s a unique idea!
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I tried this last week without thinking that I was doing this. I was asked to make a very simple small project from a old client. I asked what his budget was and he said “~$300″ and he would like to pay per hour. I told him that I understood that this project was important to him and to just pay me what he thought it was worth. I told him I was not counting my hours either. I ended up making $500 from this little project.
I would not recommend this to most people.
Good for you. Now file that info away. What were the dynamics? Getting it done fast? Solving a hard problem? Taking a hairball off his hands? He trusted you? Factor that into your pricing next time around. You learned more than you would have by simply charging a fee, no?
Seems like a very intersting idea, but not sure if I’ve got the guts to pull it off, at least not yet. As you say, there are only certain cases in which this will work, another thing you forgot to mention, which is the case for me, is if this client undervalues my work and gives me less then I would have quoted, will I have enough money to feed myself?
@Damian:
You’re right. Best not to try this if you’re worried about the rent. On the other hand, a client that ‘undervalues’ your work probably wouldn’t have agreed to your normal fee anyway. What’s useful though, is discovering what clients think is worth it, and what they don’t, in which situations. It’s sometimes painful, but that’s how you grow a sixth sense for pricing.
Trust in large business entities is misplaced trust. Furthermore, this doesn’t work with the way departments handle budgets. This may work if you’re dealing directly with a small business owner who has to look you in the eye.
This is an amazing idea! Call it the Radiohead pricing model =)
As a recently minted sole prop-er myself, I was toying with non-traditional ways to price projects, so I’ll definitely give this a shot.
It’s a great litmus test for your relationship with your client, and it speaks volumes as to your desire to give them effective work that moves the needle, as opposed to unconditional compensation.
Awesome post, insta-tweet.
Jason: Thanks for the tweet. But note that with Radiohead, 80% of buyers didn’t pay anything. This works only with eye-to-eye, hand-shake, real-life relationships. This is human-to-human.
Sort of like how you tip the waitress where you always eat lunch, versus how you’d tip when 90 miles out of town.
I’m currently doing a bit of work for a client (as we speak!) whose been with me since day -3!…[an hour later] have had a reply, offering me double what i’d normally charge – due to the fact i’ve always helped out.
client relations = king!
Good. You are obviously doing something right.
Well, I tried this method on a client who is a personal friend, I had never worked with her before, but 5 minutes after I sent her the message with this pricing idea, I got a reply that really worries me. It turns out, she is one of those clients who likes very bad and cliché design, and it seems she does not really consider design as work. So pay very close attention to the do’s and dont’s in this page. For new clients, not a good idea, you should already know how your client will act
Very bold pricing technique.
If I would ever try it than only with a long-time client on a smaller project.
I think it depends a lot on the client, how long you know him and under what circumstances you work with each other (big corporation, small family business, etc.), but I could imagine that this is a very effective method once you get the right feel for it and have a solid knowledge of human nature.
The question is if you actually lose or make more money this way (e.g. how does it look after 10 projects, etc.).
Great idea and thanks for sharing!
Ximi: You have the idea right. This for good clients with good personal relationships. If you try this, please let me know how it worked.
Did that once with a long-term client who needed a couple of banners. He just took a free ride,and I ended up working for half what I expected. But on the other hand,it wasn’t that much work at all,so maybe the client was right
That happens. I know.
But it’s always instructive to see what customers value, and what they don’t, isn’t it? It may be slightly devious, but it doesn’t hurt to show how hard you’re working on the thing. Send a bunch of prelim sketches, update and status emails, things like that.
Anyway, let us know how you make out if you try this again.
Interesting idea, I’ll add it to my arsenal of methods. Thank you
This totally freaks me out, in a good way. I’ll definitely be thinking of clients whom this could work with. I love the idea of letting the client pay based on perceived value, that way they always get a good deal.
I know. Freaks me out, too. But it sure gets your head unstuck. Which is always a good thing. Let us know how this works out for you. Good or bad.
thestartuparena.com
The scariest pricing idea ever. That works….
Here’s a pricing technique that sounds, at first, like the dumbest newbie move of all time. Call it ‘fill-in-the-blank’ invoicing. Or ‘pay what you…
This is brilliant! I’ve just gone freelance since the past half-year after being in the enterprise tech solutions sector for over eight years. One of the hardest thing I was finding to do was how to price the freelance work that I was doing. I have built a very strong relationship with the client I am working with for the past six months and was finding it difficult to give him a new quote for every two weeks of work that I did for him at times (which he used to find invaluable).
This pricing technique might just take a huge load off my mind and might help me quote for those projects which I had put-off mainly for the fear of quoting wrong on it.
Why don’t I just bend over in front of the client instead ?
Total nonsense. Your role is to lead your client, not the other way around.
If that works for you, keep doing it.
Not a fan… why? Because too many times in custom development projects you’re working with existing nightmare code. Clients don’t fully understand how much their legacy systems suck, they just want you to change the background color to green… or some other extremely trivial task. But their existing code may have 40 templates all with different CSS/backgrounds being set up. Changing the color for them to green would take you hundreds of hours, but in the age of Word Press, and SMF Themes, etc. they just expect technology — even if it was written in the past — to work like modern sites. Good luck getting paid for your XCart upgrades…
You’re right. As it says in the piece, if the work is a hairball, but the client thinks it’s a cinch, don’t go this route. Give them the hairball price.
Wow, this sounds like a great idea. Like any new awesome idea, it’s bound to freak people out. I’m glad you added the caveats at the end.
The truth is that pricing can be really tough, especially when you’re starting out your freelance business. Man oh man how I’ve underestimated my hours before. This seems like an ethical and potentially profitable way to run a lot of your business without the stress and agony over deciding on your price.
Also, BTW Walt, you may want to think about installing the “Subscribe to Comments” plugin. otherwise, it’s hard to have real dialogue on this blog, since we have no way of knowing when you respond to us unless we keep checking back at this particular blog post:
http://wordpress.org/extend/plugins/subscribe-to-comments/
Either way, thanks for the great insights!
Okay Doron. Activated a Subscribe to Comments option up in the header there. Never turned it on because no one ever asked before.
And yes, pricing is a head-scratching problem for every business. Even for the mega-corporations (who, like us, just sort of pull their pricing out of thin air.)
When in doubt, double your estimate. If you’re not losing some clients, some jobs, because you’re too expensive, you are probably charging too little.
Thanks for more great insights Walt!
As for the Subscribe to Comments option in the header, that was actually not what I was referring to, although allowing folks to subscribe to your comments might be a good thing too.
What I was referring to was installing a plugin that would add a checkbox beneath the comment form so that, if I, for example, decide to leave a comment on your blog, if I’d like to keep abreast of the conversation and possibly chime in again, I click the checkbox and now I will get an email whenever a new comment is added to your post. This tends to make the conversation more lively (not that you’re lacking in commenters here, but this would almost certainly take it to another level).
Anyhow, if you’re not sure how to install the plugin, feel free to email me and I can quickly show you.
Either way…thanks so much for the great blog, I plan on following your work from here moving forward!
This is fascinating. Sometimes I play this game with my husband, asking “what do you think this is worth?” as I crank out the jewelry that I make. Sometimes he hits the mark of what I believe the value is worth, sometimes he is way over, and other times he is painfully under. I’m really curious in brainstorming ways that you could test this out for product sales in an online platform (but that goes against your advise of only doing this exercise with long time customers, etc.) No matter what, this would be a really interesting experiment. (Who knows, you may end up with the similar success as the guy with the red paperclip!)
Courtney. I don’t know about jewelry. I’m only a lowly freelancer who writes stuff. But Google the concepts of ‘contextual pricing’ or ‘anchor pricing’. The idea, I think, is to put one necklace out there for some off-the-wall price, say $432. Then put your regular piece next to it for $167. And a cheapo for $9. The $167 one looks like a good deal in context. Which is what you would have sold in the first place.
But please note, I do not have a jewelry marketing license.
brilliant post and well thought out. I do something similar in my ongoing creativity project/job
I sit in Union Square in New York City with two folding chairs and a table and a sign that reads “Creative Approaches to What You Have Been Thinking About” and a smaller one that reads “Pay What You Like or Take What You Need”.
I sit out there with no computer, no cell phone, just waiting to talk with strangers about any subject at all that they are contending with and trying to offer a creative approach to it. No subject is off limit. I have a mason jar full of the days payments in front of me.
So people pay what they want in amount (including zero) after I have offered them a creative approach or they can take what they need – but not what they want.
People have taken money, but I have only “lost” nine bucks. I have seen the range as well – an hour spent with someone only to lose a dollar and spending two minutes with someone and receiving $20.
regardless, the point of fearlessly exploring your price point opens up new insights.
Two folding chairs and a table? I like the minimalist approach. Keep us posted. Send a picture. Do a guest post.
for a picture and a whole mess of the creative approaches I have offered please take a look at stillmansays.blogspot.com
i am happy to do a guest post if you like. thanks for the offer. you have captured my email.
best,
m
I price like that on some projects. I have a customer who values my work and wants to keep sending me projects. So he always pays me well so that he can be sure I will be there for him next time he needs me.
I think another factor is the customer’s source of money. The person I work with pays for my services out of a grant. He has no personal access to the money. Any money he does not spend goes back to the granting agency.
I would be more reluctant to price that way with the owner of a small business, because money not spent usually goes back into his pocket.
Walt, it is so awesome that I stumbled upon this post by you. I too use value pricing with my clients and have so for the last year and a bit. I’ve been writing about my experiences using the billing concept on my blog, Rise of the Innerpreneur. If you’d be up for it, email me and I’d love to share stories and ideas about using the technique. It’s hard to feel like a lone wolf;)
Tara
I am not surprised by the Wall Street guys.
I would also not be surprised if they were laughing about how stupid you were over their $1000 dinner bill.
Yep. As I said, wrong tactic, wrong client, wrong time. My bad.
This recalls to mind Seth Godin’s blog post about freelancer pricing vs. linchpin pricing. Both are valid in different contexts, but linchpin pricing changes the game.
Ha! I’ve done this and I still do it sometimes.
Actually, I do it for updates. Some clients send me pay me regularly without me requesting anything.
This is the worst idea I’ve ever heard.
“The idea is to get paid for the value the client derives from the work, rather than for the number of hours it took.”
In an industry as undervalued as ours, this has to be one of the worst pieces of advice I have ever read. I’m sorry.
I consider myself an incredibly open-minded person, but this just doesn’t sit right with me at all.
The ONLY way I see this working is when your rate per hour is that of a lawyers. $300/hr, $400/hr, etc.
Am I crazy in thinking this???
The question is, then, why are we so undervalued? Is it because clients don’t think what we do is worth much? Whose fault is that, I wonder?
I have done that before. And it is true, it works. Some hundreds over my expectation. But only with serious clients. If you are not sure about honorability and seriousness of the people you’re working for, I would not recommend it.
I do this with my online workshops. I do a sliding scale, and say, “Hey if you can’t afford that, let me know.” Most people pay at the top of the scale. Some don’t. That’s okay.
The people who don’t pay as much are often paying me in other ways, they contribute more to the conversation, they extend themselves in other ways. That’s useful to my workshops.
Interesting idea.
I know some people that will tell a client that if they are unhappy with a piece of work, there’s no charge and we both go our separate ways. So you work to make sure they are happy and if they truly are, they will not want end the relationship.
In India, vendors who want to establish long term relationships do this all the time. They’ll say a friendly “whatever you give is great”, and then you’re the one who calls the shots. Generally, you have no idea what to give, so you end up overpaying anyway or you will be indebted to them and will return the favor. (I know, sounds Godfather-ish!)
Another time this doesn’t work: when you need to subcontract the work.
For awhile, I was hounded by a firm who had switched their entire business model to this “pay what you think it’s worth” system. Apparently it worked well for them – but as a potential contractor, I thought it was absolutely ridiculous. I’d get requests like “Can you design comps for a homepage and two inner pages? We have no idea what we’ll be paying you, ultimately, but the client mentioned his budget being around $600.” Uhhh… Go jump in a lake. Maybe *they* are willing to take a risk with their clients like this, but I sure wasn’t.
Hi
I started a business in Australia in 2002 that still runs very successfully after 8 years with the “pay what you think it is worth” pricing model. Our product is massages, and we were supplying these in bars and clubs. Nowadays this b2c market is much smaller than our fixed price market (selling b2b).
We are currently expanding our site and services into other fixed price workplace incentives. I’m also looking for a designer as we speak for the new venture. I’d sincerely like to work with you, so please contact me on andrew@3minuteangels.com
We take the project from there. In the meantime, I thought i’d attach a response to a German uni student who was asking about this pricing policy for her thesis.
> > Dear Andrew,
> >
> > My name is Tanja, and I am studying International Business with
> > focus on Marketing in Cologne, Germany. At the moment I am writing
> > my Bachelor thesis dealing with “Pay what you want” as a pricing
> > model. Through some search on the Internet, I found out, that your
> > company, 3 minutes angels, are offering massages and that the
> > customer can pay what he wants afterwards. I would like to ask you
> > some question related to this topic, which would be really helpful
> > for my project. Would this be ok for you?
> >
> > Regards
> >
> > Tanja
Von: Andrew Ward
> Betreff: Re: Pay what you want
> Sure – ask what question you want.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
Tanja
Firstly, the business was created in early 2002 and now the “give us what you think it is worth market” represents just a small fraction of our market. We found the pricing and delivery of massages in the pub and club scene was excellent exposure for our brand. In fact it created for us a database of many thousands of business clients, who we now target with a fixed price offer. The fixed price offer constitutes the majority of our business, but that does not mean the variable priced products didn’t work. In fact it was sustained from 2002 until 2007 as the major part of our business.
The rest of your answers are below in CAPS. Not meaning to yell just distinguish between my responses and your questions.
—–Original Message—–
From: “Tanja Mössner” [mailto:tanja.moessner@gmx.de]
Sent: Tuesday, 20 April 2010 5:05 PM
To: Andrew Ward
Subject: Re: Pay what you want
Thanks a lot!
This is so helpful for me.
First of all, why did you chose Pay what you want as a pricing model instead of a fixed price?
THE MODEL WAS CHOSEN BY ACCIDENT. HOWEVER, I FIGURED IT WOULD BE EASIER TO OFFER MASSAGES IN A BAR SETTING (WHICH WAS COMEPLETELY NEW CONCEPT GLOBALLY) IF THE BARRIERS TO ACCEPTANCE WERE LOW. I GUESS IF I WAS BEING OFFERED A MASSAGE BY A STRANGER IN A STRANGE LOCATION AND THEY SAID “HEY GIVE ME $10 AND I’LL GIVE YOU A MASSAGE” FEWER PEOPLE WOULD TAKE UP THAT OFFER THAN IF I SAID…”HI MY NAME IS ANDREW, I’M A 3 MINUTE ANGEL, I CAN GIVE YOU A MASSAGE AND AT THE END OF IT IF YOU DON’T LIKE IT, IT IS FREE, BUT IF YOU DO LIKE IT, YOU CAN PAY ME WHAT YOU THINK IT IS WORTH”. ESSENTIALLY I KNEW EVERYONE LOVED MASSAGES AND WOULD BE WILLING TO PAY FOR THEM AFTER THE GRATIFICATION THEY RECEIVED FROM IT. I DOUBTED IF THEY WOULD BE WILLING TO PAY FOR SOMETHING THEY DIDN’T UNDERSTAND OR HAD FELT THE BENEFIT OF.
Are there any advantages/disadvantages of this pricing model?
SURE THERE ARE SOME DISADVANATAGES. PEOPLE COULD STEAL, THE ACCOUNTING WAS LESS PREDICATABLE. IT CONFUSED SOME CLIENTS.
THERE ARE MORE ADVANTAGES…NOVELTY, INCREASED TAKE-UP, USUALLY A HIGHER PRICE, OFTEN A MUCH A HIGHER PRICE, A WAY TO TELL WHO OF MY STAFF GAVE A GREAT MASSAGE AND INTERACTION AND WHO OF MY STAFF DID NOT. I WOULD SAY THE BUSINESS GREW TO BE SUCCESSFUL ENTIRELY BECAUSE OF THE WORD OF MOUTH IMPACT THAT WE GOT FROM OFFERING A UNIQUE PRICING MODEL.
How are you doing your planing without exactly knowing what you will earn? (I mean I guess you have to cover some costs, isn’t pay what you want too risky?)
WE USED THE DATA TO WORK OUT A TARGET THAT OUR STAFF HAD TO HIT IN ORDER TO KEEP THEIR JOB. THAT TARGET WAS OUR BUDGET AND PLANNING AMOUNT. MOST TIMES THE STAFF WOULD BE 20% ABOVE TARGET AND THEREFORE IF ANYTHING WAS LEAKING OUT (BEING STOLEN NOT DECLARED) THEN WE WOULD NOT BE STRESSING ABOUT IT BECAUSE WE HAD ALREADY HIT OUR BUDGETED AMOUNT.
EVEN THOUGH WE COULD BUDGET WE DID USE ‘FEAR AND FAMILY’ TO ENCOURAGE HONEST DECLARATION OF THE AMOUNT THEY RECEIVED ON EACH MASSAGE. THE FEAR WAS THAT IF CAUGHT LYING THEY WOULD LOSE THEIR JOB. THE FAMILY PART WAS THAT THEY WERE ALL ENCOURAGED TO KNOW ME AN THE OTHER OWNERS, SO THAT THEY WERE NOT STEALING FROM A NAMELESS FACELESS COMPANY. FURTHERMORE THEY WERE WORKING IN TEAMS (HOSTS OF ANGELS) AND DEPENDING ON THE AMOUNT RAISED IN THEIR HOSTS THEY WOULD RECEIVE PRIZES. FOR INSTANCE, IF THEY GOT GIVEN $100 FOR A SINGLE MASSAGE THEY WOULD DECLARE ALL OF IT AND THEN BE GIVEN A FREE COCKTAIL. EVEN WHEN YOU TAKE THE COST OF THE COCKTAIL OUT OF THE AMOUNT, IT MEANT WE’D GET $90 WHEN THEY COULD HAVE SAID IT WAS A $10 MASSAGE AND POCKETED THE $90 THEMSELVES.
What do consumers pay in avarage? What do you think your massage is worth?
CLIENTS PAID ON AVERAGE $10/MASSAGE. HOWEVER THIS MEANT WE’D GIVE TWICE AS MANY $5 MASSAGES AS $20 MASSAGES.
What do you think, why they pay at all?
PARTICULATLY WITH THE PRODUCT OF MASSAGE WHERE THE RECIPIENT FEELS SO GOOD AND IT IS OBVIOUS THEY ENJOYED THEMSELVES, PEOPLE FEEL A SENSE OF OBLIGATION AND FAIRNESS AND SO WANT TO PAY FOR THE EXPERIENCE. THE CUSTOMERS ALSO LIKED THE APPROACH. IT MEANT WE WERE SO CONFIDENT IN OUR PRODUCT THAT WE WERE WILLING TO BASE THE RESULT THEY RECEIVED ON THE PAYMENT WE RECEIVED (IN AUSTRALIA WE CALL THAT PUTTING YOUR MONEY WHERE YOUR MOUTH IS).
AS A STRANGE OUTCOME, WE OFTEN FOUND MEN IN PARTICULAR WOULD WANT TO SHOW OFF HOW MUCH MONEY THEY COULD AFFORD TO PAY FOR A MASSAGE. IT WAS A WAY THEY COULD SHOW OFF TO OTHER WOMEN, MEN OR THE ANGELS HOW MUCH MONEY (THEREFORE HOW DESIRABLE) THEY HAD.
Do you perhaps have some statistics of prices paid?
LOT’S BUT I’M NOT REALLY INTERESTED IN SHARING THE RAW DATA. AS IT MEANS HAVING TO DIG THROUGH MY FILES. A FEW STATS THOUGH.
THE MOST ANYONE HAS MADE IN A SINGLE EVENING SHIFT WAS $1000 THE AVERAGE AMOUNT PER MASSAGE WAS $10 GIRLS DID BETTER THAN BOYS WHEN IT CAME TO BEING ANGELS BOYS PAY MORE THAN GIRLS WHEN IT COMES TO WHAT GENDER OF RECIPIENTS PAY BEST AT LEAST ONCE A WEEK (AND USUALLY MORE OFTEN) A RECIPIENT WOULD PAY OVER $100 FOR A MASSAGE.
So far, I think that’s it. But perhaps some more question will come to my mind later on. I take up on your offer then.
Thanks in advance,
Tanja
it worth if you just started as a freelancer… its good idea if you want to know you real price to the customers or its worth if you do your friends work. But, if you started as professional, you must have price list.
I use this quite often with people I have a long term professional relationship with, and existing clients, but as noted, I rarely, if ever would use this with a new client. I use an hourly rate as a baseline for most of the jobs I do, but never actually quote by the hour.
Lentil As Anything is a restaurant that works this way, eat and pay what you feel the meal was worth. The idea absolutely works, and is YES scary however this method will really shift the conversation value. Don’t know about you, but I have a sense of value I trust and I appreciate being given the opportunity to exercise my values.
Definitely interesting, and as you say, will probably only work in certain circumstances…
I would definitely be reluctant to try this because I find most people who hire me to do their websites are 1. entrepreneurs with small budgets 2. they’ve never worked with a designer before 3. they have no idea how long it takes to design or build a site, and don’t comprehend the value of the work.
I use a questionnaire to get a bit more info about a client’s project, and to determine their budget, and more often than not, people expect branding/logo, web design and development on a content management system for under $1000. The average person just doesn’t know how much a website is “worth”, but then again, I’m guessing “entrepreneurs” are probably not the target for this type of pricing scheme (with some exceptions I am sure).
Too often I’ve had people who want e-commerce, blogs, galleries, and branding, but their budget is a few hundred dollars. For the most part, I could not see that system working in any of my current circumstances… but I do think there could certainly be potential for this type of payment… definitely something to think about!
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This might actually be just the thing I was wrestling with earlier today.
Retired mother-in-law who really, really wants to learn how to make a web site and will pay me to teach her over the phone. I know I can’t charge her enough to keep the lights on and of course I want to give her the best. I also don’t want to walk through a blogger.com site over the phone and actually charge my usual fee.
I’ve been on the verge of using your idea a few times and always balked, but this might be just the time to try it!
Thanks.
You have articulated this topic really well. I have definitely tried this before and it works like a charm. You do have to be careful about who you try this with though. Long term satisfied customers, customers in urgent deadlines and ones who are generally reasonable about costs value this sort of a pricing/engagement.
I have seen that a bigger benefit from this sort of a pricing model is a stronger relationship that develops with customers who come back to you time and again.
Another thing I have done in the past (ours was not really a services business but a niche solution business) is defined the pricing and after discussing with the customer that it doesn’t fit with their current quarters budget, I agreed to discount it to “make it happen” and they greatly respected that. And then made up for it the next quarter.
I would highly recommend it.
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Excellent idea! Thank you.
This was what we did until fairly recently, when we finally had to admit that if you’re nuns who do web design the client NEARLY ALWAYS thinks it should be free/cost less than with anyone else. A lot depends on how the client perceives you, quite independently of your work. Cost and value are different concepts for most people: devising a CMS can take a lot of time but the client sees it as being dead easy to use, so what skill is there in devising the web site in the first place?
Lame ideea. Maybe would apply if i was in UK or US, but @ here. they’ll give me 30 bucks for all the projects no matter the complexity.
I once did a small job for a customer and rather than asking for payment, I suggest they look at my Amazon wish list and choose what they thought the job was worth. I was nicely surprised when they bought the entire list!
AFAIK, non-cash payment is also not taxable, as is trading services for services, so I’ve also exchanged technical work for design work.
I love this story. Why is it that most business relationships are so adversarial, so contentious? Is that necessary?
Great article… going to dismiss all my employees and hire you to work for me.
Tell me something… what about “bad clients”? The ones that give a lot of work, lots of drafts, don’t know what they want, and in the end pay you almost nothing ?
Perceived value may work for you in your reality but the meaning of value is different from person to person, even from country to country…
In my reality this only may be applied when we do small works. Not for a hand coded website for example. People don’t care if you did spend lots of hours just to understand CSS or PHP… They just want the job done.
Kind Regards,
TV
This isn’t a good idea for ‘bad clients’. And working with ‘bad clients’ isn’t a sound long-term strategy anyway. Better to figure out a way to deliver work that good clients want.
You should also check out Seva Cafe.
They’ve used the same concept for providing a pay as you wish eatery in ahemdabad, Gujarat, india.
You can go in, sit down, have a full meal and before you leave, you’re given a slip which says – “your food has already been paid for, however, if you so wish, you may deposit any amount you wish in the jar at the counter.”
The jar itself is a clear, open box where you may put in any amount and take out any amount. The jar never remains empty.
Love this idea. Going to give it a go with a few local clients. As others have said, bit risky to try it with a first-timer client (at least for me at this stage), but you’ve gotta take big risks to make big gains, I guess!
Fabulous piece. Thanks for writing. One thing is for sure – adopting this approach will teach you alot about human nature and the way people “buy” service. In my experience, ya never know about people. Some folks are really appreciative of good service and value, others don’t see beyond themselves and their own interests. This was a courageous approach.
In Melbourne there are some restaurants that do not have prices. You pay them as much as you think the meal is worth. My feeling is that either I will overpay them or underpay them – the first will leave me feeling ripped off and the second guilty.
If I was to get a contractor to, for example, fix my roof, I would like to get a quote so that maybe I can compare it to other quotes or check to see if it is within my budget. If it is over budget, I can then maybe discuss using cheaper materials or get another quote.
As a freelancer, for jobs that are too difficult to estimate, couldn’t you just say “my hourly rate is x, I will work until the job is finished and invoice you accordingly”?